Welcome!

Proposals like this one are not fun or exciting, but they will keep happening because our system is not perfect. It makes sense to try to take a step back and consider the circumstances.

To me, the key when considering reimbursing losses due to price decline is what happens when there are winnings because of price appreciation. In Core Team we have asked for extra money when the price has gone down. In our case, when the price goes up, the network benefits because we ask for less money after that. We don't operate for profit, so nobody is pocketing anything.

Some other proposal owners have acted in the same way. They have provided more services with the extra money and earned something similar to what they had expected at the original price.

Others, of course, have profited from price appreciation a lot. And that is not wrong as long as they also cover the losses if things go the other way.

In the case of Frame 48, they haven't had the chance to show how they would act if the price went up, so there is no way to know for sure. Even declarations would not help here; there would be no way to enforce those.

However, in this case, I vote yes. I have a combination of several reasons for that:

-A big part of their loss happened between the time they posted the proposal and when it got paid. There is no way to plan for that, except asking for big buffers. Nobody wants that. They posted with plenty of time, which is great for everyone, but that increased their risk.

-In all my contact with them, I have felt they care. I believe that if the price had gone up, they would spend more on even higher quality production, or save for another project. Of course, this is my perception, and I could be wrong, but that is what I have. Were they reckless not adjusting their proposal more when payout happened? Probably, but I sympathize with someone that wants to deliver what he promised and wants to keep a high standard.

-It makes sense to finish things that are already started and still make sense. If we consider the first proposal a sunk cost, which it is, here we can get a great video finished for an amount that would not give us something comparable starting from scratch.

-Their product is great and we dearly need high-quality content to promote Dash.

All the above is my personal opinion; I'm not saying that we should establish hard rules on when compensating for losses. The system is new, and we are all learning and adapting as we go.

Thanks for weighing in Fernando.

It is much appreciated, and I’m glad Frame 48 will receive fair payment for their efforts.

Hi guys,
Need to clear a few things up re Frame 48 - they are not paid by Kuvacash at all, nor did we have anything to do with organising them to do so.

They are working independently to produce emotive content that people outside of crypto will want to watch - but they are doing this for Kuvacash other projects as well. For example they will be shortly covering Venezuela in the same way.

The content they did produce when following our team in Zimbabwe was amazing, which is because Seth is a legend and documentary professional par excellence - just because they have done a great job so far on covering Kuvacash, some people have labelled it an 'advertorial' which is absurd.

If we want people of Seth's caliber to be involved in Dash and making it look incredible, then please get on board and vote - they are asking to be covered for costs due to Dash going to less than half its value, most of which occurred prior to them receiving the initial payout. If they are 'punished' for this, expect that this world-class team which is telling the story in a powerful and emotive way that connects with people (this is because Seth actually feels that Dash can change the world, from scratch) will walk away - and that is not good for Dash at all.

This will be content you will be proud to show your friends and colleagues, not to mention it is film festival quality that could put us firmly on the map.

We can fit this in - it is important that we have a team of this quality and passion (which is very hard to find) covering what we and others are doing to get Dash adoption, and to make it a powerful story.

For anyone who has not watched the trailers, I'll post a link up. Show your friends and watch them say 'wow, is that what you guys are doing?!'

https://vimeo.com/256250469/f7effd0e8b

https://www.dash.org/forum/threads/pre-proposal-frame-48-–-starting-from-scratch-–-devaluation-funding.37953/

In particular, please watch the second embedded video where James talks about Dash and it’s key benefits which is why people can adopt it as a payments and money solution.

It's this kind of content that both engages people emotionally and gets them to want to know more about Dash.

Dash can definitely afford people and teams of this caliber, and this will fit in the cycle so let’s get Seth and team sorted!

Thanks,
Drako

My thoughts exactly, this is finally something I won't be embarrassed to share with my friends and family to get them to understand why I am so excited about Dash

I use Dash music video 2, because Dash music video 1 was not embarrassing enough!

https://youtu.be/eVzggP7k3fo

Seriously tho, my “go-to” hype video for Dash has been (and will always be) ‘Girls love Dash’ :}

https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=8EZ8U5F8V1U

This still fits, and we still have 15+ hours to go. Not their fault that the Dash value dropped so much from the time they proposed, to the time they got paid. Rain down the YES votes.

solarguy

If all stays as is (6 hours left), congrats on passing! Looking forward to the release.

I’ve voted yes. It’s easy to point fingers but the reality is that Dash did drop a lot in price between the voting deadline and when they could reasonably have been expected to convert that Dash into fiat.

Walter

+1 voting yes

voted yes as well

I voted yes. But I'm not sure I would just give away such content from the start. What I've seen thus far is of such high caliber that it should be entered into the full gamut of movie festivals. It may speak to Somebody Important who can distribute this far wider than grass roots can.

For some reason I was sure I had already commented on this, but suffice it to say, I've been very impressed with your content so far and would love for you to continue documenting Dash's first steps toward making a lasting impact on the world. What you do is essential to effectively communicating the value of Dash in all its facets to a broader audience in a way that simple vlogs and your standard crypto content can't. This budget cycle is shaping up to be really rough but I sincerely hope we're able to fit you in.

Voting is over. Everything above and including dashradar will be voted in and everything else will not get more votes.

Yeah, that's basically not true, tons of votes have come in within the last few hours. You're misinformed.

Thank you for pointing this. Yes One more day still to go.

Voting doesn't close until tomorrow night. More than 24 hours from now. Not sure where you're getting this.

Why didn't you cash out all the dash you would need to cover costs when you first received it at the higher price? Has Kuvacash contributed funds? It looks like this will in part be an advertorial for them.

Hey bitedge,

Our proposal was submitted when DASH was valued at $732 back in mid-February, but the budget wasn't payed out until March, after the large crash.

This documentary is not advertorial in nature, and we think it would be inappropriate to accept funding from subjects that we are so closely following, especially when presenting this outside of the DASH community. The need for a financial solution in Zim is very obvious when watching the footage, and the arguments that they and other professionals have for DASH implementation is convincing enough when we have taken a non-biased and critical approach.

The treasury should not be providing “extra” funds to anyone because of devaluation as that is the risk you take when you take a project.
No one has ever returned extra funds on because dash price went up.

You are covering one specific project which is why this is being pushed through. Such groupism is wrong and this looks like a free g

In a month where there is budget available it might still be okay to provide some funds, but to prioritise another $50,000 for you in such a difficult month and snatch funding away from other projects who have managed things better will be very unfair.

To Jeremy:
1. They are not covering one project (KuvaCash). This covers other efforts as well, like Venezuela.
2. "...other projects who have managed things better..." Frame 48 bears zero responsibility for making poor management decisions about their Dash. From the time they put their proposal in, to the time that they got paid, the value of Dash dropped. What could they have done differently? They were powerless to have any effect by their "management".

solarguy

Hi Jeremy, I disagree.

Frame 48 should not be punished for submitting their proposal early (allowing a decent amount of time for voting) and not arranging escrow on their first proposal (who would have expected a huge drop like that between submitting a proposal and payment date).

They proceeded regardless and need to cover costs to finish their project.

This time they have learnt their lesson and have arranged USD pegged escrow with Dash Core.

This is not their first and last project for Dash, as they intend to do the same emotive coverage for current Dash Venezuela projects and more.

If we want people to become passionate about Dash, we need to connect with them on an emotional level. If you view the example footage you can clearly see it’s not an ad, it’s a real doco with real people, and very powerful stuff.

I’ve viewed other Dash documentary footage from another currently funded team and they don’t even come close to the quality we are getting from Frame 48.

Frame 48 are in a completely league and deserve to be paid so they can continue to provide value to the Dash network.

Maybe someone from Dash Core can weigh in here, (as they did with the BitGo proposal).

Dash Watch May 28th 2018 Report on
Dash Adoption DocuSeries Zimbabwe: ft. KuvaCash EP01 Full by Frame48
https://dashwatch.org/files/1527559490765.pdf

Dash Watch April 27th 2018 Report on
Dash Adoption DocuSeries Zimbabwe: ft. KuvaCash EP01 Full by Frame48
https://dashwatch.org/files/1524872654356.pdf

Let's finish this. It is not unreasonable to ask for some additional Dash to compensate for the big drop in value over the last few months. Logically, the other alternative is for all proposals going forward to tack on 50% for "just in case" money to counter the risk of another big drop. We don't need or want that as a solution to the volatility problem.

They're doing the work, they're reporting their progress, the results are professional and we have every reason to finish this project with a little additional funding. This will be a tremendous resource that can get integrated into future marketing for the next decade.

Voting yes,

solarguy

Yes.

YES. .....to cover volatility. Fair enough.

Thanks Criticalinput. We have come very far since the beginning of this project, and we just need to push for finishing. The community's ongoing support means a lot to and we look forward to putting future proposals forward.

Looks professional and if and when it hits film festivals hope you can rally support.

God bless you all.

Cheers, thanks bchamz. We're releasing this straight to the public for free, so it can be a tool for all of us to use right away.

Yes from me, good luck.

so you want more dash to cash out to pay expenses now that the dash price is low from so many dash being cashed out?

"We are seeking funding to cover the devaluation of Dash since our proposal was approved back in February. Our initial budget was $167k USD when Dash was valued at $732 USD weighted monthly average."

We have confirmed fiat guarantee with the core team to cover future volatility, but I see your point. Unfortunately we cannot currently pay our vendors with DASH, but we hope that any market influence that our cash-outs may incur will be dwarfed by the positive influence of a meaningful, emotional, documentary that shows DASH's true potential.

Frame 48 has done outstanding working so far and are due to release the documentary soon which will highlight the hardship that many face in Zimbabwe and how they will be able to profoundly benefit by using Dash. I'm certain that their documentary will prove to be remarkable at highlighting exactly what Kuvacash is working towards.

I think we should fairly compensate this team for their efforts providing the unforeseen circumstances and the expenses that they have incurred thus far. Also in general I believe that we should recognize proposals that meet or exceed expectations with regards to deliverables such as this, and offer our support when necessary.

I would like to see them submit more proposals in the future.
Good luck

Pardon the typo "Outstanding work"

Thanks Foxtrot!

There are different kinds of proposals, ones that take on the currency risk and those who don't. In this case, they did the work, they shouldn't be losing money. Voting yes.

The Frame 48 team always bring their A-game and deserve to be paid.

The community appreciate your talents. Solid and emotive content.

Voting YES!

I think we should have a bit better framework in place, so to ensure, that the requests for extra Dash become a thing of the past. Maybe some form of advanced, escrow service where the escrow service cashes to fiat ahead of time or something (just brainstorming here)

* I voted yes

Thanks! We agree.

Dear Frame48,
I realy apreciat the quality of your work.
As you confirm yourself, you are more focus Zim and Kavacash project.
As Kuvacash is a private project outside Dash.
For theres raisons you dont became top priority project for me.
In this context of low tresory. Its a no vote, to let more budget to Dash projects.
Kuvacash can certainly paie you with there NOTE coin, its the main money of your main customer.
Regards,

Thanks for the feedback Jol. We really hope that you reconsider. We consider Kuvacash as a pivotal part of the DASH ecosystem. If content creators only focused on how DASH works, then all we would have to market ourselves is explanatory videos; those might work for one target audience, but if DASH is going to grow to be what we in this community all want and know that it can be, we need to make emotive content that broadens the archive of information to appeal to other audiences. What I personally find amazing, and what I think other people will find amazing (and is also a credit to the innovation of the DAO) is how a group of global individuals saw a desperate problem in a country that most of them had never been to, and decided to fund a group of experts to fix it with DASH as its foundation. That is why it is an important story for us, and one of many that we would like to tell in collaboration with the DAO.

Kuvacash is a very important part of our ecosystem, and there are many more organizations like them that we would like to focus on in the future. We hope that comes into consideration when you are casting your vote.

Thanks,

Seth

Dear Frame48,
I hope than Dash are put in the good place on the documentary. Without Dash, nothing of all of what you cover exist as a solution.
I change my vote to yes in this espectation.
Regards.

Thanks Jol. I think your expectations are reasonable and that you will be sufficiently satisfied with the result :)

Cheers,

Seth

The way Dash impacts outside of this immediate community via significant treasury funded projects like Kuvacash is very much a part of the Dash story that the rest of the world - and particularly future potential high value proposal makers should know.

Do people even look at how much of the budget is actually available? So far, with four days until the voting deadline, roughly 3680 Dash out of 6176 are accounted for. There's no need to penny-pinch on account of a budget shortfall this month.

Hi Jol,
Dash community members are aware that you have been trolling non-stop on Kuvacash-related projects. Frame 48 has been doing an incredible job of documenting exactly what is possible when the DAO puts its mind to it, and their documenting the Kuvacash progress getting Dash into Zimbabwe is extremely valuable to build advocacy not just within, but also OUTSIDE of Dash - it is content that will have a very long life, and indeed may be an important historic archive.

I agree with Voluntary (below) we want as many people to be aware of what the power of Dash can do as possible. Note that Frame 48 is also documenting other teams and progress, and we want them onside - Seth and team are an incredible resource for Dash.

Drako

Dear Drako,
Insulting me as an answer, tel more about you than about me.
Its strange than you understand my bad English this time, I Apreciat it. Tank you for the efort.
You sale NOTE coin as a big value for DAO, im sure you can sale this fact to FRAME-48 too.
FRAME-48 do great job, i hope in the future they cover Dash project.
Regards.

JoL, nothing that you said makes sense on any level. You are just here trolling again.

Both the Frame 48 and Kuvacash teams are doing amazing work on their individual projects.

You are daft if you vote ‘No’ and still ‘hope’ or expect Frame 48 to continue working on their Dash documentary (which covers a variety of different Dash DAO projects and initiatives) if you close off access to funds.

In addition, the Kuvacash team announced the Utility Notes (and gave them away voluntarily and free of charge) to MNOs AFTER they had already received funding for their Kuvacash project. Implying that they ‘sale’ them to anyone as ‘big value’ is just you trolling and being disingenuous again.

Frame 48 are independent film makers and deserve to be paid for their work.

Could you please provide a single example of a way that your participation in Dash has helped the DAO? I feel that you are a concern troll and have pointed this out to the community many times.

Hello everyone, this is Omar Hamwi with Dash Core Group and I confirm that the Dash Core is in receipt of a signed escrow agreement

Every proposal made late last year has experienced the same devaluation.

Compensating one proposal owner for devaluation means opening a pandora's box of similar demands from other proposal owners and will end up causing serious heartburn when those have to be turned down.

We don't have to reimburse every proposal, we are free to do it on a case-by-case basis. The only question you have to ask is, do you want this work and relationship to continue?

This is a powerful story that connects with people. That emotional connect builds trust and loyalty with end-users; a sense of belonging. Compared to other marketing projects, it has a stronger and much longer shelf-life

I think Dash Core Group should not be offering fiat guarantees because it handcuffs the masternodes if the price declines, putting us in a position where we have to choose between paying extra, or having the crucial core team budget suffer which is not an option. It would be fine if it was a well funded third party that can afford to take the risk and won't force us to reimburse them if it doesn't go their way. I hope this works out but I don't think continuing to do fiat guarantees with core is a wise decision.

Thanks for the feedback Troy. We agree. I think as our market grows there will be more agencies with the appetite for risk that may come in to serve as escrow services for the community.

hey
so this documentary is not about Dash , but about Zimbabwe (struggle + eventual solutions) and Kuvacash ?
any interviews from Dash in there as well ?
sorry, might have missed it written somewhere else

reg price drop in budgets ,
proposal owners are speculating on price rise (get more US$ eventually), and parallel should carry the risk of a price drop as well !
just my 2 Duff's
ty

Thanks for the feedback tungfa

The documentary outlines the economic problems of Zimbabwe and what the Kuva team is doing to solve those problems. The heavy focus on the solve for those problems is the DASH foundation that Kuva is built on and the amount of value add that DASH can bring to the country.

We understand the speculative nature of price, but a 50% drop in value severely impacts what we can do as a production company to ensure a polished product, regardless of how much we trim back on. The timing could not have been worse, which is why we have gone the escrow route to make sure it does not happen again.

tx for the quick feedback