Proposal “dash-retail-dev--10-launch---dao-owned-m“ (Active)Back

Title:Dash Retail Development & 1.0 Launch - Comprehensive DAO Owned Merchant Platform
Monthly amount: 101 DASH (6861 USD)
Completed payments: 1 totaling in 101 DASH (2 month remaining)
Payment start/end: 2019-10-16 / 2020-01-13 (added on 2019-10-14)
Votes: 746 Yes / 31 No / 10 Abstain
Will be funded: Yes
External information:
Manually vote on this proposal (DashCore - Tools - Debugconsole):
gobject vote-many 370a4a196ee52e288da3968b49ea126ceb8077deb5c0054174565ed770458179 funding yes

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Proposal description

Dash Retail is a full, all-in-one solution for Dash merchant adoption efforts. It will be fully DAO owned and offers merchants the ability to accept Dash as well as buy and sell it from their customers.

Dash Retail offers a Dash ecosystem in a box, It’s a turn key solution designed to be deployed by local teams across the globe to rapidly and sustainably scale Dash adoption efforts all whilst offering full transparency and accountability via direct Dash Watch access.

Full Demonstration Video
In this video we demonstrate the full Dash Retail platform in its current release, we have loads more features in the coming months including integration of our local agent powered fiat off-ramp solution.

Basic Version Demo (Android + Hardware Device)
These videos demonstrate the basic version of Dash Retail, a lite version that gets merchants set up and accepting Dash in seconds with a mobile device or a dedicated, multi-screen and receipt printing hardware device:

Achievements to Date
  • Dash Retail pre-alpha launched and already in use across Latin America with documented 100% uptime.
  • Public, at-a-glance Dashboard launched featuring full live transaction and merchant activity reports.
  • Comprehensive, real-time Dash Rates system set-up, in use in the Dash Core Group wallets (including your Android or iOS wallet!) providing the real time price data that your wallets use from 12 different data-sources with API access open to other DAO projects. (
  • Crypto:Crypto exchange pilot launched ( that will be used to power the volatility offset aspect of Dash Retail with over $50,000 transacted so far.
  • Dash Retail full demos at Dash Convention Europe and hundreds of plays on our Dash Racer game.
  • Full-backend access and transparency to Dash Watch including all transaction data and financial audits.
  • Full vending machine integration both directly via MDB and in partnership with Qibixx AG

What's Next
This proposal funds us up to our 1.0 LTS (Long Term Support) release. This version will include:

  • Agent hierarchy system (allows adoption teams to sign up merchants & report transparently on their transaction count / volume).
  • Fiat off-ramp functionality powered by and with local agents (subject to local partners).
  • Continued QA and testing to ensure system is absolutely bulletproof.
  • Settlement options to allow merchant to choose how much Dash is converted versus how much they keep.
  • Other small but important features like tipping.
  • Stable hardware device options for physical POS based merchant adoption. 
  • On-going support of our Dash Rates infrastructure that powers the fiat pricing in your mobile wallet
  • Full code and license given either to Dash Trust or the DIF (or to the DAO via another mechanism decided by vote)

Team + Roles
Ash Francis &, Alex Cox. Alex is our technical lead with 10 years development experience and Ash provides design, front-end development and project management. As Dash investors we are working at a reduced salary to return the greatest benefit and ROI to Dash whilst also building a codebase that our other projects can benefit with alongside Dash (likewise, assets and work from these other projects is being brought into Dash Retail).

Alex, Ash interviewed by Mark Mason at Dash Convention Europe:

We have reduced our monthly ask by 20% and for the last few months have not requested funding, choosing instead to fund from our own finances. This cycle we are asking for $8000/mo based on the 30 day SMA from BitInfoCharts of $79. This purchasing power will stretch to cover our further reduced salaries, office rent, infrastructure and other costs. All Dash Retail financials will always be fully transparently reported to Dash Watch and happily subject to audit.

Get In Touch
We are happy to answer any questions either on this proposal or you can reach out directly on the details below.

Telegram: @ashfrancis
Twitter: @ashtonfrancis
Discord: Ash#8776
Skype: ash.francis

Thank you for your support.

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Discussion: Should we fund this proposal?

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1 point,3 days ago
This is wicked! What a great project, what a great product, I can see the attention to detail, you seem to have thought of everything. This system will be a pleasure to use for both the merchant and the customer. Well Done !
1 point,9 days ago
@AshFrances I would like to commend you for submitting the IP to your work to DASH DAO. We need to see more of this type of sentiment from other project owners.

I would request if you could if a specific license agreement has been drafted for this purpose? The reason I'm asking about this is we do not want the work to be used by any other crypto currency. Dash is paying for its development and therefore DASH should receive the benefit for this investment.

My concern is that you stated that George Donnelly is a "partner" in your project. However, Donnelly has not received funding for his merchant program and from his twitter posts it is clear he has not taken this well. As a consequence he has been posting negative comments about DASH's on his twitter feed. In one feed he has responded to one of Roger Ver's posts as follows:
This tweet was posted on Donnelly's twitter feed on 4th November:

Roger Ver posted: "Bitcoin cash has more physical adoption than any other crypto currency"

Donnelly tweet in reply to this comment: "Starting to look that way, Especially if we decide to teach our 1,150 active merchants across Latam about #BitcoinCash

Still debating it internally"

This sounds like an intention for Donnelly to training the merchants we funded him to sign up to accept Bitcoin cash.

Can you therefore confirm that you would be willing to sign an IP transfer agreement to the DAO with the specific wording that the IP can only be used for DASH network projects and for the promotion of DASH and cannot be used to be adapted, changed or used as a basis for any other cryptocurrency. If this was to occur it would be an infringement of IP rights and the DIF would have a legal basis to go after and claim damages against any individuals or organisations that are using DASH DAO owned IP that is outside of the terms of the IP agreement.
2 points,9 days ago
Good question, George has not had any real involvement in Dash Retail, his name was on the first proposal and he was supposed to be piloting it and helping define how it should function but he has done neither of those things. The one thing he has done is take our pre-alpha (which is just a fork of Spark with minor modifications) and put it into a lot of merchants, but that's outside the scope of the main software project that is Dash Retail. As far as I am concerned, George is no longer a partner or involved in Dash Retail.

When it comes to formalizing the legal side to this, currently we are in discussions about how best to approach this with DCG and the DIF, it's a nuanced thing and is again more new ground. I think whichever way it is owned/controlled via the DAO means that 'Dash' would get to dictate its own terms on who it awards sub-licenses to and the clauses that cover those licenses.

It's worth noting (and I have said this quite a few times so I apologize for sounding like a stuck record!) that Alex and I will retain a full license too to use/modify/commercialize the DR codebase in our other projects (like
4 points,21 days ago
Dash Watch October 2019 Report on
Dash Retail by AshFrancis
0 points,26 days ago
This initiative is not viable. We can spend the $20,000 so that Ash and Alex can save face and not get totally screwed financially, but it does not change the fact that the project will have to be abandoned at some point.

Why? Because you don't develop custom, commercial software like this. This type of thing is VERY EXPENSIVE to develop and support. You need a committed team and lots of money. The story here is that Ash and Alex are going to get us to "LTS" (Long Term Stable) and then "let's see what happens."

What is going to happen is that there are going to be requests for more funds to build George's vision, about which he just had an epiphany...

And so here we are: George is expecting the DAO to build this for him. What he wants looks an awful lot like Kuvacash, except the kUSD is now a Dash stablecoin. Which leads me to...

Creating a stablecoin does not help the end user who want to hold USD or their local currency. This stablecoin is only a proxy for what they want. They still can't do anything with it. And it gets us into all kinds of regulatory scrutiny...

Now do you see that I am not a troll? Now do you see why I want this voted down?
3 points,26 days ago
Another day, another top-level Geert comment, responses:
- DR Infrastructure costs are around $6000/year, if this is paid by the DAO either by our prop or by the teams that use DR then DR (and Dash Rates) will run indefinitely.
- Once we hit 1.0 the only on-going upgrades needed are small as the protocol changes and to update our node, this will not cost much, if anything.
- If the DAO wants us to develop more features or wishes us to pause development and stick with 1.0 until a later stage, then we will do so.
- DR is not developing its own stable coin or a wallet solution.
- The DAO can always award DR development / hosting / support / etc to another team as it will have a full license to the code.
George is a partner in DR but also has his own opinions that he shares on his blog, don't speculate by conflating the two. You're still railroading this proposal and posting speculation as fact and attempting to spread FUD with a barrage of top-level comments that are completely inaccurate and show you for the troll you are and continue to be.
-5 points,26 days ago
I thought that once we had the DIF in place, commercial software initiative like DR and DashTaxi would go through the DIF and we would not need these unpleasant, public brawls anymore. I hope that day comes soon.
6 points,26 days ago
You have a complete lack of self awareness; '.. we would not need these unpleasant, public brawls anymore' whilst you tell me to move back in with my parents, effectively call me a parasite on the DAO and spam this proposal. This is a commercial initiative, it is free software for the good of, and owned by the DAO, just like the wallets. As I said before, if you can't see the DAO owning 100% of this is far better than a business that may or may not succeed being built off of it and the DIF only partially owning it, then you are hopeless.
3 points,26 days ago
That should be 'is NOT a commercial initiative'.
-3 points,25 days ago
I am not hopeless, but I suppose you COULD call me cheap. I simply don't want to spend $20,000 USD on this thing.
3 points,25 days ago
You are hopeless if you can't see what is blatantly true 100% ownership is better than partial ownership. It's fine you don't want to spend $20k on this, make whatever point you have, let me respond and stop spamming this proposal with new top-level comments.
-3 points,25 days ago
Why can't vendors use their existing POS and accept Dash using an iPhone or Android wallet? They could record the sale as whatever currency they use and simultaneously book a purchase of Dash for the amount of the sale.
5 points,25 days ago
Why using the mobile wallet as a POS doesn't work:
- Doesn't scale to businesses where owner isn't in store
- If owner leaves store has to entrust device to clerk
- Funds are kept on-device which could be stolen
- One device per store doesn't work with multiple currencies
- Accounting is far more complex
- No dedicated hardware device with receipt printing and customer screens
- No retail specific functions like tipping, invoices, receipts, etc.
- Not measurable by the DAO through transparent metrics
- No direct line of support to adoption team
- Doesn't work as a web checkout or for vending machines, for transit, etc. (not extensible)
- Offers no automatic off-ramp / volatility offset functionality
- No remittance system outside of something very manual and insecure
- No option to facilitate sale of Dash to customer or purchase of Dash from customer with commission (outside of something very manual and insecure)
1 point,3 days ago
You've convinced me. :joy:
6 points,27 days ago
This proposal is an easy yes from me. They have clearly put in quite a lot of work, and continued funding will create benefit to Dash. There is a lot of FUD posted in the comments, but in my opinion its just hot air. Obviously, I haven't gone to all the trouble of researching all the detail. And there lies the problem. I'm only an MNO - I spend a few minutes on each proposal. That's how Dash works - if you want fully informed decisions by people who know what is going on, this isn't how to get them.
3 points,26 days ago
Thank you kevmate, we try to keep our proposals succinct but we are always happy to go into more detail. Regarding the FUD posted in the comments, I just want to make it clear that this is one person (Geert) and based on the latest mnowatch reported we have 50 MNOs voting yes and just 2 voting no.
4 points,27 days ago
It's an easy yes from me. Looks fantastic already and just what we need to provide more native POS solutions.
-6 points,28 days ago
There is no company at this point willing to support this commercial software. It is being built "on spec." For that reason alone, it should be abandoned immediately. We should not spend another penny on it.

This project typifies the OLD WAY the Dash treasury did business -- toxic personalities, inept "entrepreneurs," misrepresentations to the DAO, and the basic funding idea that can be summed up using the following pseudocode:

do {
 create proposal
} while (DAO not fed up)

Unless we hear from the DIF or DCG about how important this codebase is, we should let it die.
3 points,28 days ago
More personal attacks and railroading, for anyone else reading this please see further down. I'm happy to answer any and all personal questions but won't entertain this troll further, thanks!
0 points,27 days ago
Are you okay?
-3 points,27 days ago
Where is George Donnelly? This software is being designed to his specification, and he stands to benefit most from its release. The fact that he is not here (as George Donnelly at least ;)) reaffirms in my mind the idea that the DAO needs to move forward in LATAM without George.
6 points,1 month ago
Easy yes from me, good luck.
4 points,1 month ago
Thanks Qwizzie!
-8 points,29 days ago
At first I imagined that Ash wanted to the DAO to pay for this software to be built because he intended to use it for some future business he has planned. After pressing him on this, I now believe there is actually no real business case for the software, and he believes there is no real business case for the software, and he's just bored and wants something to build.

We are already funding MyDashWallet, DashElectrum, DashWatch, DashNexus and we should be funding DashCentral. I don't think the DAO is in the position to take on another software project that has no intention of producing revenue.
2 points,28 days ago
Perhaps you should really consider the use cases, the IP is what the dao is getting and anyone is able to submit a governance proposal asking for a copy to run, with the intention and understanding that it will benefit DASH in some fashion.

It allows the entrepreneurs amongst us to build exciting business around, and support dash and the dao in some fashion

This all would be impossible without developers such as Ash & Alex who are openly sharing there IP with the participants of the dao.

What did KuvaCash or Benn Swann give you in return? Took millions and nothing to show and no material benefit to dash

Think about this parting thought for a minute if KuvaCash tech was accessible by other participants of the dao, perhaps someone would have risen to the challenge to complete the task that they had started.

Therefore allowing the project to come to fruitation in some fashion and ultimately benefitting the DASH.

I hope this encourages you to do some research before making baseless accusations tantamount to slander,

I have used personal funds and time, and travel costs inter alia, to meet and talk to vast majority of the dao participants and to get an accurate sense of there ambitions goals and ideals, in order to make informed decisions around my votes

I HIGHLY urge every MNO to actively search and research every DFO, and make educated and informed decisions to the best of your abilities ( VC's do not make money on passive investments, they MUST have some degree of involvement) we need to be thinking along the same lines to ensure similar outcomes of our investments as MNO

Thank you
-9 points,1 month ago
You seem to me like another entrepreneur taking advantage of the Dash treasury to build your own brand, with no intention of giving anything back to the DAO except "moar adoption."

You even create a proposal that promises a "launch" if funded. Taking a page out of Drako's playbook are we?
6 points,29 days ago
Yeah man you seem to have it out for this proposal. Why don't you use this energy to go after actual grifters instead of Ash who has a proven track record of being committed to Dash and building solutions that other people in the Dash ecosystem actually need.
9 points,1 month ago
- We work 60 hours a week for Dash.
- We take a third of what we could get elsewhere and many months we take no salary and I cover our costs from my own personal finances.
- We donate our spare time to countless other Dash projects.
- Our Rates API is in use in core infrastructure and open to other projects and is fully launched:
- Our alpha is already launched and has done over $30,000 in Dash transactions.
- We launched the first local adoption tracker in partnership with Dash Latam.
- We are giving our entire project to the DAO as an act of good faith, not building a business out of this and instead offering the most return to the network where multiple businesses and entities could benefit from our work.
- Everything we have done has been fully transparently reported to Dash Watch and we have a full financial audit trail and have given them full back-end access to our data.

The license to Dash Retail is most definitely intellectual property and makes much more sense to belong to the trust or the trust via DCG than it does the DIF. When I attempted to explain this to you, rather than accept your lack of knowledge, you doubled-down, even ignoring the fact that I have had many conversations with DIF supervisors. You can try and derail this proposal because you're upset I called you out, that is your right to comment as an MNO, but the truth is there is no merit to a thing you say and now you've resorted to attacking me with baseless accusations.
-6 points,1 month ago
You want to take money from the DAO to create commercial software, and you want to dictate the terms. Like I said before, you have it backwards.
7 points,1 month ago
You're attempting to railroad this proposal with loaded questions, constantly moving goalposts and circular arguments. To be honest I'm not sure whether it's worth answering you or just ignoring you, either way the avenue you take is harmful to Dash.

It is not our software as I have made it very clear that this proposal would mean FULL ownership belonging to the DAO via the trust. This would mean an irrevocable license to distribute, use, reuse, modify, sub-license, commercialize alongside all code with the only proviso that we would also have a license too.
-7 points,1 month ago
A pile of unsupported code is worth nothing. As of November 8, 2018, there were already over 100 million github repositories.

Have you drawn up a legal agreement regarding what rights the DAO has to your software and support for that software, or you have been too busy coding to get to that yet?
5 points,1 month ago
Go Ash! Great job!
3 points,1 month ago
Thanks! Thrilled with the feedback here, on twitter and discord :) we've pulled a lot of long nights and weeks - there is a lot more to come too!
2 points,1 month ago
Hey Ash, could you detail by what mechanism this is DAO owned?
4 points,1 month ago
Good question, we've always built this with the DAO in mind as a provider rather than any commercial interest. I would define ownership by either full ownership and code given to the DAO or a full irrevocable license and license to sub-license given to the DAO.

In terms of the actual mechanism for ownership the most logical process is to either give the ownership (or irrevocable license + sub-license as mentioned above) to the Dash Trust or alternatively directly to DCG and thus by extension the trust. As part of this cycle we'll make that a reality subject to our costs being covered but just to be clear on this - that is our full intention and always has been. Should there be issues in the logistics of this we'll search for an alternative path potentially giving to the DIF or a trusted Dash entity like Dash Watch. The final option would be to open-source it but that would be for the DAO to decide and not us.

The one proviso is that due to us working at less than half our rate if we were doing this purely as a software house is that we too should have a license to use/reuse/modify etc part of the code in our other projects.

Hope that clarifies but let me know any further questions, I'm happy to dive deeper into this / sign an MOU or even give the code now as it is to DCG / the trust - though in my mind this makes more sense at 1.0 stage.
-6 points,1 month ago
The DAO is not a legal entity and therefore cannot own anything. Have you spoken to the DIF supervisors regarding this initiative?
8 points,1 month ago
The Dash Masternode Network (The DAO) is the ultimate beneficiary of the The Dash DAO Irrevocable Trust (the 'Dash Trust'). The trust is controlled by the elected trust protectors for the benefit of the DAO. The trust also owns 100% of the shares in Dash Core Group inc. Whilst this may not be direct ownership it is very close to being so. If we give either all our code (and full license to it) either directly to the Dash Trust or to Dash Core Group Inc. It will be for all intents and purposes owned or at least controlled by the network.
-6 points,1 month ago
You didn't answer my question.
7 points,1 month ago
The DIF is the Dash Investment Foundation, this is not an investment and as such is outside the scope of the DIF, it isn't a revenue generating entity nor is it a business. I have had conversations with three of the four elected DIF supervisors and my understanding is that the Trust is a much more suitable owner of Dash Retail unless Dash Retail seeks to become revenue generating.
-6 points,1 month ago
You could easily send a small amount of crypto back to you or your company with each transaction made with the software, and so this sounds to me like a potential commercial enterprise. Please speak to the DIF supervisors.
7 points,1 month ago
I agree that there are a lot of commercial applications that could stem from Dash Retail
- Transaction Fees
- Off-ramp Fees
- Hardware Revenue
- Add-ons
- Fiat / Credit Card Support

But our belief is that the base software should be free for anyone and everyone that wishes to serve Dash subject to DAO approval, and should always act towards the benefit of the network. If a business seeks to build off Dash Retail (or if we choose to do so), that business should award equity to the DIF (and the DAO can give the source code as a condition of that partnership). However it makes sense for Dash Retail itself, as an infrastructure tool (and our rates platform, powering the fiat prices in the mobile wallets and elsewhere) to be owned by the network and always act for the benefit of the network. This doesn't rule out a commercial aspect but instead opens that commercial aspect open to more than just us and protects the networks interests.

As an example; I would argue there are or could be a lot of commercial applications to the Dash mobile wallets - embedded exchange, retail directory adverts, username premiums, links and other affiliate programs but it makes sense for the base 'reference architecture' to be owned by the network.

Happy to expand on this and hear your viewpoint - I'm very supportive of the DIF and its role in the space. Our crypto exchange ( will be seeking involvement from the DIF and that will hopefully come before the DAO too in due course.
-8 points,1 month ago
You're asking for seven thousand dollars worth of Dash in a very tight budget cycle. Many issues are unresolved regarding what you intend to do, and the only thing you have to offer is a vague promise that someone will "award" equity to the DIF.

I think you have it backwards. I cannot support this unless and until the DIF is satisfied with what you are doing.
5 points,1 month ago
Let me try and make this more clear; Dash Retail will be 100% owned by the network. Perhaps in the future a business will be started using the software and that will give equity to the DIF but that is not what we are focused on right now. Dash Retail will be DAO owned software, either by the trust, Dash Core Group or by a chosen representative of the DAO. This is much BETTER for Dash than a partial ownership given to the DIF.
-6 points,1 month ago
I get it. You want the DAO to give you money and you don't want to be held accountable to anyone because this is all for the good of Dash. Where did I hear this before?
6 points,29 days ago
Im not sure why my previous comment was not posted.

However, i urge you to make an informed decision.

I too like you was skeptical initially of ash & alex, having said this we have moved on beyond this.

As they have time and time again demonstrated they have the networks best interest at heart.

Without a doubt, I will be voting YES.

5 points,1 month ago
We are held fully accountable and more accountable than almost any other project by the code and license being owned 100% by the DAO - being free to award development to any other provider it chooses and award the codebase to multiple different teams if it wishes. We have been paying ourselves around $3600 a month each, which is a third of what we could be paid elsewhere. We work 60 hour weeks and donate our spare time to the good of Dash, we've contributed to countless projects and are highly invested in the success of Dash, we have full transparent reporting to Dash Watch with them having full access to our back-end. If you can't see that the DAO owning Dash Retail via the trust is far better than any other option then we shall have to agree to disagree. Thank you for your consideration.
-5 points,1 month ago
The Dash Trust has four primary roles.

1. Own the shares of DCG
2. As shareholders, reassign the DCG board if the masternodes instruct it to do so
3. Assign or hire the trustee of the Trust
4. Hold other passive assets that ultimately belong to the network such as patents or trademarks assigned to it by DCG or other legal entities, and enforce any associated licensing requirements.


I don't see anything here that would indicate what you have in mind is appropriate.
7 points,1 month ago
If DCG owns it then it is akin to how DCG owns the core wallets, and its assets and other infrastructure.

If the trust owns it then it is akin to number 4 on your list, an asset which can be licensed.

If either of these end up as not suitable, then we will give it to an alternate DAO appointed representative.

This is about as far as I am willing to entertain you, we put a lot of work into this, there are many months where I fund our costs myself and we work incredibly hard for the DAO as I mentioned above. You have not given me a modicum of the respect I've given you and this isn't the first time you've harangued a proposal owner based, quite frankly on ignorance. You did the same with the DIF, ultimately changing your mind but not before posting 26 derailing comments.

I respect the DAO as a whole and really appreciate the fantastic support we're getting but if you as an individual wish to argue semantics over ownership despite everything else and disrespect us despite all we do then you can leave your no votes and that is that.